I think that is stated too. But its like if time were on a multi time stream in SM, then why do things in the past affect Chibi Usa's future? Like with the example I made? There are a couple other instances that happen in the manga and I think even in Myu. And with the way Pluto sometimes talks about time it seems pretty linear at times to me. Its like...it goes both ways sometimes when it comes to time.

Small Lady wrote:

I think that is stated too. But its like if time were on a multi time stream in SM, then why do things in the past affect Chibi Usa's future? Like with the example I made? There are a couple other instances that happen in the manga and I think even in Myu. And with the way Pluto sometimes talks about time it seems pretty linear at times to me. Its like...it goes both ways sometimes when it comes to time.

Or maybe the Chibiusa that comes back for training is the Chibiusa that belongs to that particular time stream and the one that showed them Crystal Tokyo is a different version of that Chibiusa? (Or maybe Naoko thought about all this, got a headache and decided no one will pay attention to it anyway. )

Because it brings up the question as to why Crystal Tokyo- or even Chibiusa- didn't waver/fade as well when Demand kidnapped the Past Sailor Moon since it all hinges on her? Then we would have to further ask, if the senshi knew what happened in the future- why did they allow it to come to past and basically saving everyone's lives instead of allowing them to suffer?

(Back at the thread topic: or we could go the funny route with Cosmos and say that she's the produce of all the family lines of the Sol System that got together and she's the last remaining 'royal' blood member that happens to be the reincarnation of Usagi and that her 'crystal' is actually result of the Silver/Golden Crystals coming together <3 ))

I would assume that the Sailor Moon Universe has a linear time continuity where everything is headed, we could call this the "natural timeline" or something. However, it is possible to deviate into other timelines if someone is actively trying to change destiny as Nehelenia, the Black Moon Clan and Hell Destiny attempts to. There seems to be a delay in time when something alters destiny, this provides some evidence, albeit nothing too strong, that there is a single "true" timeline but things can go awry, possibly a timeline that is focused almost entirely on the destiny of the Silver Crystal.

I'm still fond of my Cosmos incarnations are privileged to the same properties and abilities as the Chaos incarnations. the Cosmos seed can exist in different forms simultaneously in the same universe and time period. Usagi, Cosmos, Chibiusa, Chibichibi, Princess Serenity and Queen Serenity would all be incarnations of the same seed in the same way Nehelenia, Death Phantom, Pharaoh 90 and Metalia are. They can all exist with their own personal memories and histories but still be incarnations of the same thing.

Sailor Azoth wrote:

My head hurts...

I'm for the idea that Usagi has an eternal soul (as she is Sailor Moon) and becomes Sailor Cosmos in a future reincarnation.

I definately agree. I've always thought that Usagi would continue reincarnating after she died, and if trouble were to strike, she would once again have to become Sailor Moon. Perhaps her final form in a distant life was not Eternal Sailor Moon, but Sailor Cosmos?

Sorry to interject, but I have been wondering the same thing myself and I found my way to this forum in search of the answer. Before my account became activated, I read through this thread and though the theories presented make sense and I like them I feel like everyone is leaving out something very important.

Sailor Galaxia (in the past was the strongest senshi in the universe) before Chaos overtook her, she sends out her Star Seed to a safe place where Chaos would not find it. It finds its way to Sailor Moon in the form of Chibi Chibi.
In the last act of the manga, when all of this takes place, it is revealed that Chibi Chibi is Sailor Cosmos. When asked if she is the Ultimate form of Sailor Moon (which would imply that she is *in some sense* a form of Sailor Moon. The author would not have asserted this idea if she didn't want you to think it)
Sailor Cosmos then says, "I remembered the battle here....if I had destroyed the Cordon back then." This also implies that she is an ultimate form of Sailor Moon.
Also, Sailor Cosmos says that "Myself here was alone and suffering too. That's why I kept close and supported her. To help her make the right choice." The picture beneath this text is Chibi Chibi embraced by what could be EITHER Sailor Cosmos or Sailor Moon. A close reading of that line (especially the Japanese, which is more accurate) alludes to her meaning her relationship with her past self i.e. Sailor Cosmos kept close to Sailor Moon to make her do what she thought would be the right thing.

Sailor Cosmos then says, "We can do everything over." This line also suggests a cycle, a rebirth, thus leading into a theory which involves these ideas.

I am aware that what I just said is very similar, if not exactly what others have said. But where does Sailor Galaxia fit in? Like I said, it was Sailor Galaxia's star seed which led to Chibi Chibi which led to Sailor Cosmos. Could it be that Sailor Galaxia, once the strongest senshi (very similar to Sailor Moon's role as the strongest senshi, though she may show her strength in a different way) was a past incarnation of what Sailor Moon is? This is why Sailor Moon is able to find her hand through the Chaos- both of them are the same. Both are incarnations of Light.

Basically, I am frantically searching for a theory that ties in Sailor Galaxia to Sailor Cosmos's existence. There has to be a connection and without including Galaxia in the theory of who Sailor Cosmos is then how can we ever figure it out?

Chibichibi being Galaxia's starseed was only in the anime. and by Stars, the anime has pretty much become a seperate thing from the manga...so it's kind of hard to combine the two. so good luck finding a theory that connects Galaxia>Chibichibi>Cosmos.

the theory Naoko-sensei wouldn't project an idea if she didn't want you to think it doesn't have much bearing really, for me. with the similar hairstyle from a distance and powerfulness, of course the Quartet who have only slight aquaintance with Sailor Moon would wonder. would any of the senshi ask a similar question? that perhaps would answer a lot of questions for us.

I've never liked the idea of Cosmos being Sailor Moon. i look at the hair and markings, and i can't accept it. through 2 lifetimes, Usagi/Serenity has kept her odango and pigtails, and her curled inward bangs. in Cosmos, we have heart buns, and wavy curled outward bangs.

i could accept the idea of Cosmos being an alternate universe form...much like Kousagi. though honestly, i'm REALLY looking forward to that page in the new manga, which is more accurately translated in my opinion...XD it has the ACTUAL japanese names for crying out loud!!

To add to this, you also have to count in Cosmos's eye color too. It's not even blue and why would Usagi's hair turn red of all colors if it's a disguise? Especially when all her other disguises are usually blonde hair or white. Blue eyes are actually very common in the series. Why would Cosmos's eye color change any different from her Chibi form if she is 'Sailor Moon'? (Her eyes are Lavender.) Even Usagi=Serenity keeps the same eye color.

Anime nonwithstanding, I'm a bit more convinced Cosmos =/=Usagi. Maybe reincarnated, maybe descendent.

Crystalsetsuna wrote:

Chibichibi being Galaxia's starseed was only in the anime. and by Stars, the anime has pretty much become a seperate thing from the manga...so it's kind of hard to combine the two. so good luck finding a theory that connects Galaxia>Chibichibi>Cosmos.

You're completely right. Thank you so much lol I was driving myself crazy! I was really confusing the anime with the manga :X

Houyou no Senshi wrote:

My theory:

Chaos and Cosmos are the original creators of the Universe. Usagi Tsukino is simply an incarnation of Cosmos who exists eternally in some shape or form. The same way as Chaos can be Metallia or Nehellenia at the same time, Cosmos can be Usagi or Sailor Cosmos or even Queen Serenity at the same time. The Sailor Soldier versions of Chaos and Cosmos in my theory would appear from time to time throughout history.

My theory kinda stems from this one. In my head, when Chaos gains a senshi form, it means that it finally had a minifestation that was its "true form." It had all of the memories from the other incarnations but was also the ultimate, pure form.

In the same way that Chaos was Metallia and Nehellenia and everyone else, Cosmos had taken on the form of Princess Serenity and Usagi (and maybe also Queen Serenity or Chibiusa, as well as many others). Sailor Cosmos is supposed to be that true form, but after the events in stars, she realizes that Sailor moon/Usagi was truly the strongest and most pure.

I feel like this explains some of the personality and look changes but still fits with the "me of the past" stuff. Let me know if anything I said is stupidly wrong though!!

Ｏｈ　ｍｙ　ｈｅａｄｃａｎｏｎ　ｉｓ　ｖｅｒｙ　ｓｉｍｉｌａｒ　ｔｏ　ｔｈａｔ　ａｓ　Ｉ’ｖｅ　ｄｉｓｃｕｓｓｅｄ　ｉｎ　ａ　ｓｅｐａｒａｔｅ　　ｔｈｒｅａｄ。 aaaaaaaaand turning off full width now.

Mine also extends to the Sailor Soldier being the true form of a Star seed not exclusive to cosmos/chaos. This would mean the Sailor Power Guardians, the Talismans, the Guardian Weapons, would all stem from the same star seed but the true seed would be the Sailor Soldier.

I do believe Usagi is Sailor Cosmos's past self since it is stated so in the manga.

I don't believe that she is a descendant because when Endymoin was killed and Chibiusa vanished, if Cosmos was a descendant she would have vanished too.

I don't believe she is from an alternate timeline or dimension because in the manga it states that she had already fought in this same battle and she came back to this battle for a reason. If it was an alternate timeline or dimension, there would have been no reason for her to go to a separate dimension to change the timeline since it is connected.

We know that Usagi already has the Lambda power, the power to lose everything so that she can save everything.

We know that as Neo Queen Serenity her heart has weakened and she was more vulnerable because of this and she can't become Sailor Moon.

We know that like NQS Cosmos's heart was vulnerable and she only remembered the Lambda power after being with Usagi, when she was at her strongest emotionally and mentally.

It's really more up for debate on what time frame she came from and exactly how she turned into Sailor Cosmos.

Is Cosmos the reincarnation of Usagi, the way Usagi is the reincarnation of Serenity?

Did Chaos attack after they had already been reincarnated or did he attack during Neo Queen Serenity's reign? Or did he attack during her daughters reign?

Those are debatable :/

nerf-or-nothing wrote:

I don't believe that she is a descendant because when Endymoin was killed and Chibiusa vanished, if Cosmos was a descendant she would have vanished too.

That's a good catch. It kind of puts to rest the descendant theory. I mean, the only way it would have been possible after Mamoru died is if Usagi married someone else at some point, and I really don't see that happening.

My theory is that Sailor Cosmos is Sailor Moon in a very,very distant future,a future were her daughter Princess Usagi Lady Serenity has become queen

I think she is Sailor Moon from another world, so to speak. Weather or not she is in fact the Usagi from this timeline or an Usagi from a parallel world can be debated. 

There is a chance that the is Usagi from the direct future of the timeline; where Usagi was petrified at the loss of everyone's star seeds being thrown into the cauldron and fled the battle; and centuries of isolation led her to travel back in time to make sure she didn't screw up. 

Either that, or she as Sailor Cosmos was unable to travel through time. (Insert Pluto and the Time keys the only thing to use to travel here) She might have discovered a way to access different universes, thereby accessing their timelines. She might have known that this Usagi, our Usagi, would go through the same struggles she herself did that led her to abandon everything and didn't want her to suffer the same fate. 

While it would be really cool, I personally find it hard to believe that as Neo Queen Serenity, Usagi would have been able to transform into Sailor Cosmos. If she were, she would have been able to prevent at least half of what occurred in the black moon arc. Sailor Cosmos has the ability to create a complete and thorough disguise to the point where the talismans can't see through it nor detect her presence as an "outside invader" since in cannon, she is not from their timeline/world. Along with whatever abilities she had obtained to travel through space-time/alternate worlds, she would have been able to minimize the Dark Moon and Nemesis threat. It might still have happened; but it might not have been as devastating. 

That's how I see it, anyways.

Cosmos-Hime wrote:

While it would be really cool, I personally find it hard to believe that as Neo Queen Serenity, Usagi would have been able to transform into Sailor Cosmos. If she were, she would have been able to prevent at least half of what occurred in the black moon arc. Sailor Cosmos has the ability to create a complete and thorough disguise to the point where the talismans can't see through it nor detect her presence as an "outside invader" since in cannon, she is not from their timeline/world. Along with whatever abilities she had obtained to travel through space-time/alternate worlds, she would have been able to minimize the Dark Moon and Nemesis threat. It might still have happened; but it might not have been as devastating. 

I think it was even stated that NQS was no longer a sailor senshi. I always thought that if Usagi did turn out to be Sailor Cosmos that it would have to be long after her reign as queen.

What if NQS wasn't Usagi's most powerful form? She could have evolved after that to take up the mantle of Sailor Cosmos, but I do agree with Adelaide, it wold really be a long time after Crystal Tokyo. Maybe there was a tragedy that forced her to evolve or maybe she passed the mantle to her daughter.

IT is  Sailor Chibi Chibi Moon who is Sailor Cosmos


After Sailor Galaxia's death, Chibi Chibi revealed to Sailor Moon that her true form was in fact Sailor Cosmos. Her future, as told to the Sailor Quartet, was not a hopeful one - Sailor Chaos waged war against the universe, and everything and everyone Sailor Cosmos knew was destroyed to the point where nothing could be salvaged even if the war ended. Upset, scared, and unable to do anything, Sailor Cosmos ran away from her future, opting to go into the past to destroy Chaos before it achieved its terrible Senshi form.


http://wikimoon.org/index.php?title=Sailor_Chibi_Chibi_Moon

That was done in the 90s anime. As the events are different in the Manga, people still speculate as to who Sailor Cosmos is

renegadeviking wrote:

IT is  Sailor Chibi Chibi Moon who is Sailor Cosmos


After Sailor Galaxia's death, Chibi Chibi revealed to Sailor Moon that her true form was in fact Sailor Cosmos. Her future, as told to the Sailor Quartet, was not a hopeful one - Sailor Chaos waged war against the universe, and everything and everyone Sailor Cosmos knew was destroyed to the point where nothing could be salvaged even if the war ended. Upset, scared, and unable to do anything, Sailor Cosmos ran away from her future, opting to go into the past to destroy Chaos before it achieved its terrible Senshi form.


http://wikimoon.org/index.php?title=Sailor_Chibi_Chibi_Moon

Well yes... Chibi Chibi was a form Cosmos took on, but Cosmos herself is still an actual mystery. She claims she is hte future Sailor Moon and there is still lots of spectulation if she is ACTUALLY Usagi/Moon of the future or a descendant or something else.

Edit: cause i didn't read it properly. -_-

I have a theory that Sailor Cosmos is actually Queen Serenity. 

While I haven't read the manga in its totality I came to this conclusion on the basis of Luna and Artemis' relationship to planet Mau and Sailor Tin Nyanko. 

As I understand it, Luna and Artemis fled planet Mau when their planet came under attack and came to be royal advisors to Queen Serenity. That being the case, it is stated by Sailor Tin Nyanko that Artemis and Luna were traitors to planet Mau, because they failed to stay and fight Sailor Chaos/Galaxia when she destroyed their home planet. 

However how can this be? If the Sailor Wars began during that time, it would mean that they had been going on since BEFORE Usagi's birth,yes (or rather during the time of Silver Millenium)? Luna and Artemis are the only ones who are not reborn (Which actually makes them pretty old.),and thus there isn't an alternative explanation for how that might have occurred in the future given that planet Mau does not exist at the time of Crystal Tokyo.

This brings me to my other theory wherein Usagi is born/created as a clone of Queen Serenity, the virgin goddess of the moon. This theory seems to hold true in so far as her having gone to the Galaxy Cauldron to bestow life through the agency of the Silver Crystal upon Usagi/Serenity. She created Usagi/Serenity to take upon her role in the future in the case that she found herself unable to definitively seal Chaos (Which she didn't when Chaos-Metalia was unleashed.). This may explain why Queen Serenity was not reborn (However it would appear that Guardian Cosmos hints that she might be?), because she is Usagi, and Usagi her. This is why Sailor Cosmos recognizes Usagi as herself within this age, but not as a relative proper of Chibiusa (Talk about confusion. ''Hi, I'm your grandma and mother!'').

This also gets to the heart of another (Perhaps this would be better as a fanfic?) theory I have regarding Sailor Pluto's love for Mamoru in the Black Moon Arc. Is it possible that upon the creation of Serenity she was unable to pursue a relationship with him? I know that she is bound to the door of time,but it seems curious that there wouldn't be some sort of relationship between Sailor Pluto and the Galaxy Cauldron. If anything I think it's possible that Naoko Takeuchi remained undecided on the matter, or just forgot about what had already been established as canon. After all, shouldn't the Guardian of Time and the dead play a role in the restoration of their respective memories? Wouldn't it have been Sailor Pluto who guided them to a particular time where they might safely be reborn?

Mind you, I think that there was TOO much going on in the way of introducing Outer Senshi (I know I'm probably in the minority on this one!), but I think it didn't allow for a full fleshing out of the Moon family. If anything, the Outers should have been supporting characters with very particular and defined roles limited to guarding their respective spheres of influence as was the case with Pluto and Saturn (ie. Saturn being summoned in the battle against Chaos to seal and destroy it.). I'm not sure where that would leave Uranus and Neptune, but perhaps it would have made for a more solid plot that way. It would have allowed for a more developed Moon kingdom back story in my opinion. The Outer senshi during the time of Silver Millennium appear to play a very different role than they do when reborn in the present. Stars just seemed to exacerbate the problem by introducing a host of senshi from other solar systems without tying up a number of loose ends present in the series itself. The anime only makes it worse by leading us to conclude that Galaxia and Usagi are the same person vis a vis Chibi-Chibi, but in there defense the anime works off its own continuity and canon, but I digress. 

Now on to my Sailor Moon Crystal related query:

Do you think that perhaps we'll get to see the Inners and Outers in their Super Forms guarding the tomb of Neo Geo Queen Serenity in the Black Moon Arc?Perhaps even a glimpse of the Amazon Quartet as ChibiUsa's personal guard?

Back to the manga related tangent:

While we're on the subject of ChibiUsa I have the following question: If previously there were no Asteroid Senshi during the time of Silver Millenium, where'd they come from? Were they created by Usagi for the particular purpose of guarding ChibiUsa? Given that it would appear that all the Senshi are immortal, does that mean that ChibiUsa would never ascend the throne? After all, if the Senshi with the exception of Usagi aren't going to have children (and won't die from old age) then it makes sense that ChibiUsa would have her own guard as opposed to inheriting the guard of her mother. Perhaps ChibiUsa would eventually come to rule her own galaxy as is hinted at by Nehelenia who remarks that she and Serenity came from a distant star/galaxy. I know that there exists a relationship between Helios and Mamoru which is never entirely fleshed out, but it would appear that Helios and Mamoru are parallel incarnations of one another (Not that Helios is a duplicate of Mamoru, but that he and Mamoru share a common origin/destiny.). Helios being the Priestly incarnation of Mamoru. Now this gets a bit more complicated in that we never get a back story as to the relationship of the two guardians of the sacred crystals, Helios and Serenity (Perhaps even Nehelenia?). 

It is established canon that only females have Sailor Crystals, yet lo and behold we have Mamoru as owner of the Golden Crystal. We likewise have the Shitennou reverting to their Crystal forms which allows Mamoru to seek their counsel on occasion in the manga. As a  friend of mine informed me, the source of the Golden Crystal is not the Galaxy Cauldron, but comes from elsewhere. However we never get a definitive source for the Crystal itself, nor do we get an explanation for the Shitennou's Crystals not returning to the Galaxy Cauldron and being reborn as they were (Possibly?) during the war that broke out during Silver Millennium.Did Naoko forget about all of this when she wrote the remainder of the series?

LOL

No takers?

Interesting theory about Queen Serenity being cosmos and all, but she was long gone way before the battle with Chaos, having sacrificed herself so the senshi and her daughter could be reborn in 21st century earth. She didn't survive that.

And in terms of Luna and Artemis being traitors from planet Mau and all that, the planet could have been destroyed without their knowing, be it they were in service to queen serenity or their planet was destroyed during the events when they were training the senshi during the 21st century.

But isn't it established canon that they left during the time of Silver Millenium and fled to the Moon Kingdom? At least that is what I gathered from their exchange with Animamate Mau. That would seem to place the Galaxy battle in the past, no?

Regarding Chaos' various incarnations, wasn't Nehelenia one of them? Where then do we place the Maleficent-esque encounter between Queen Serenity and Nehellenia at the "birth" of Princess Serenity? Wouldn't that make it possible for Queen Serenity to have gone up against various incarnations of Chaos during Silver Millenium?

@east02west, Just a friendly reminder to please read the rules of the sections before posting. In theories and debates you are supposed to put [Theory] or [Debate] in the front of your thread title. If you check out the other thread titles in this section, you will see what I mean.  Please change this thread title!

Thanks!

Done.

But then why would she have fled the battle? In all forms of cannon, she fought for the sake of her kingdom and her daughter.

We never learn why she fled to the Moon, but it's possible that she did so because she lacked the very qualities Usagi does.

Note also that Queen Serenity always sealed away these entities and never truly dealt with them head on. I mean the fact that she encountered Chaos-Nehelenia pre-Dreams arc and prior to Chaos-Metalia (Who is just some bizarre force, and not like her later incarnations.) seems to imply that she went up against them and perhaps failed.

If Chaos could have multiple forms simultaneously, why not Queen Serenity?

I've always assumed Cosmos is the future Sailor Moon. She mentions she was once a coward (I believe) for fleeing the moon. So in my head, she fled the Sailor Wars once everyone was killed/died in battle and was the last one standing.

Cosmos mentioned she IS a coward who ran away from the final battle and she can't match Eternal Sailor Moon's strength, so that imply's that she's an alternate Sailor Moon

But honestly i can never stick too one theory on Cosmos. One minute she's the future Sailor Moon, next minute she's my OC Shiro

I'm confused about Sailor Cosmos. I thought Usagi was Neo-Queen Serenity in the future, not another form of a sailor senshi. Can someone explain exactly the point of Sailor Cosmos?