Hey all!

Okay so I will keep this short and sweet. Obviously one of the biggest problems in the anime is that Mamoru is made to be a university student in the beginning of the anime, which I don't even know why. It was kind of pointless to do that. But that's a different story

I always see on several other forums and tumblr posts how Mamoru is a pedophile or that its creepy that he is dating a middle school student. I don't know if this is anyone else's impressions, but personally even before I knew that he was in high school in the manga, I just always assumed that Mamoru either went to school early, like at 16, to his university (its a common occurrence in Japan) or that he was at the least, 18, which I don't think necessarily classifies him as a pedophile, but that's just my opinion.

But the common assumption I see is that Mamoru is SUPER OLD like in his 20's or something. I never thought that as a kid and I still don't. I think he's just a young freshman in college when the anime starts, not GRAD SCHOOL haha.

So opinions? Mamoru Chiba, young college student or creepy old-head?

lol. I always jokingly call Mamoru's anime character a pedo but that is just in jest. It's fun and easy, especially with the weird facial expressions that he makes.

Quote :

I just always assumed that Mamoru either went to school early, like at 16, to his university (its a common occurrence in Japan)

Why does everyone think that??? Not that you guys are wrong, I just could never understand why just about everyone I know who talks about this topic always says that they think that he has gone to school at an early age. O.o I mean, I realize that he appears smart, but what is the basis for this theory? Anyway, I digress from the topic of this thread.

Ok, so I always felt that Mamoru in the anime is eighteen and is in his first year of college. I am not sure why I always thought this -- maybe because he seems on the younger side to me. But anyways, if he is eighteen years old, I must admit that that is really not such a old age at all.

When I was young, eighteen was a mature adult. But now at just about twenty-six years old, an eighteen year old guy is a boy, quite frankly (no offense to you young-ins ). They are quite immature for the most part and still very much a teenager. Playing in arcades or the like is not such an ordinary thing (especially in Japan!). So to me, Mamoru in the anime is not such a mature or older fellow -- he's really a kid himself.

Now paring him with a fourteen year old girl ... well, Usagi is rather young. And in the anime, she is especially immature. However, there is really only a four year difference. I do not think that makes him a pedophile, although if he had sex with her, that would constitute as statutory rape (but he never does, so that's not even an issue). To me, what it really boils down to. is if they can tolorate and handle each other. If so, than age is really not such a high factor here.

Mamoru shows that he is quite intelligent when it comes to his studies (Usagi says in the S movie that Mamoru reads books that she can not understand) and he is studying to be a doctor. So, yah, he seems to be quite smarter than Usagi. However, he is also rather ... silly at times, which I feel is shown mostly in the beginning of the R season when he has lost his memory. He is seen being really serious about an arcade game in one episode, and makes a lot of silly faces and such when babysitting.

So, I think anime!Mamoru is a mix of maturity but also not such a far stretch from Usagi's age. She is quite young in the first season but I feel that once she settles into her role as Sailor Moon, she gains a wisdom and maturity that allows her to settle into the same level as Mamoru. They end up really suiting and complimenting one another's personalities.


My verdict? Anime!Mamoru exonerated of said pedo!charges. ^^
(Although, to be honest, why Mamoru was caught riding a child's train in the first season is just beyond me. Ah, maybe that shows what a kid he is in heart. )

Sailor Jupiter wrote:

Quote :

I just always assumed that Mamoru either went to school early, like at 16, to his university (its a common occurrence in Japan)

Why does everyone think that??? Not that you guys are wrong, I just could never understand why just about everyone I know who talks about this topic always says that they think that he has gone to school at an early age. O.o I mean, I realize that he appears smart, but what is the basis for this theory? Anyway, I digress from the topic of this thread.

Oh wow, really? I never thought that a lot of people thought that! I thought it was just a headcanon/personal thing with me, since I had a great majority or friends that graduated at 16. Plus, I don't know. It always made sense to me because of the typical "homeschooled smart orphan who advances quicker to escape his surroundings" type of character that I just thought he was? HAHA but realistically I could say that he's 18. Just not like 25.

But yes I totally agree. Mamoru is made out to be just some overly mature guy who doesn't understand how to be fun. But why would he be on the train? Or in the arcade with Motoki? Or at the crane trying to get a doll that looks like him? Totally awesome points, so I agree Jupiter! NO PEDO HERE.

Personally I don't think he's a pedo. In the anime, I think hes made out to be way older than he really is, Im pretty sure hes actually 18 or so in the manga (not totally sure, just something I heard). Now if Usagi was a 10 or 12 year old then yes, Id have to say it would be a bit disturbing.

I think it was a mistake on the animators' part, yes, but it still manages to not be TOO creepy. Mamoru DOES act more aloof to Usagi than in the manga, so it doesn't feel as "wrong".

Chiba Mamoru Tuxedo Mask (Age 17-18)

Source: The Materials Collection, Page 14

Arekuzanra wrote:

Chiba Mamoru Tuxedo Mask (Age 17-18)

Source: The Materials Collection, Page 14

Yah, in the manga he is younger because he is in high school. However, it does not take him very long before he enters college. So I think ... maybe he is not that much younger in the manga compared to the anime. Perhaps it is really only a year or so difference.

Thanks for that image though!

I don't get why people think he is older other then how he is portrayed, I guess. But in Japan isn't legal age 16? I believe you can get married and all that at 16 also, I think its more so other countries ideals is where this is a problem. Like the US your legal at 18, married is legal at 18 and so on to it makes others uneasy I guess? When you don't actually think about where this is actually coming from, that is just my two cents.

I always concidered him just more mature male, then like say any of the middle school boys Usagi has around her.

I actually think that he is more mature than those of his own age group and that's why many people think that he may be older, like in his 20's or so. Personality wise, he is definitely more mature than Motoki and his other male friend, Kobeyashi from that one SuperS episode.

Maybe that's why many fans think that since he is in college, he has to be old? But just as in the manga, with the previous post, I think that in the beginning of the anime, Mamoru had just turned 17.

...considering that they're both (a.) *technically* over 1,000 years old in time, and have lived through at least about 40 years of life and (b.) are both semi-adult and (c.) the age of consent for marriage in Japan is 16 and (d.) their relationship is platonic early on, I don't really find it that big of an issue. They were both raised (originally) in ancient times, and didn't people get married way earlier back then, anyway?

If it was two characters of the same ages but in different cirumstances, it would bother me- but there are so many mitigating circumstances with MamoUsa.

I really don`t get why people think he might have some kind of a weird fetish. In the manga it is stated he`s 17, and then he enters university which you enter at any age actually. My boyfriend studied in the uni. when he was 14 because he knew math or something lol.

anyways, it is only a 3-4 years difference. I see girls who are 16 and date man who are in their 20s.. My boyfriend was almost 20 when we started dating (I was 17) and it`s normal.

I think it is the writers' portrayal of such an immature Usagi in the anime that makes people gravitate towards the curious nature of Mamoru's age. To be honest, I think a fourteen year old dating anyone is too young. However, Usagi is not a normal teenager and I think she matures quite fast due to the harsh reality of her job as a senshi (even though the anime continues to make her quite immature the majority of the time).

Mamoru is a gentleman though, so one can not really blame him of anything.

Although the writers do put him in the most curious of situations at times. XD

Let's not forget that Mamoru went after some jail bait not named Usagi Tsukino:



Kidding aside, calling Mamoru a pedophile wouldn't be accurate as it doesn't appear that he has an affinity for younger people, or at least that doesn't seem to be his overriding criterion for having a relationship with someone. The manga does a better job of justifying their relationship given that Mamoru is clearly attracted to Usagi's charm and overflowing abundance of love and care. And once they realize their previous relationship, it solidifies the attraction they hold for one another.

The anime kind of stumbles around by a) having Usagi act like an immature brat a majority of the time b) increasing the span of time Mamoru teases Usagi in juvenile ways and c) increasing Mamoru's age by a year or so. When all of these factors combine, instead of having the miracle romance or the ultimate fusion of Gogeta, you're left with a weird relationship which leaves one to wonder at times why Mamoru puts up with Usagi.

Sailor Jupiter wrote:

Now paring him with a fourteen year old girl ...
well, Usagi is rather young. And in the anime, she is especially
immature. However, there is really only a four year difference. I do not
think that makes him a pedophile, although if he had sex with her, that
would constitute as statutory rape (but he never does, so that's not
even an issue).

But isn't there that episode early in the S season regarding first kisses, and when Michiru begins to talk about the topic, there's a brief cut to two nude silhouettes which bear an uncanny resemblance to Mamoru and Usagi? I'm not suggesting that seals the deal, but that whole episode was rife with suggestion, and it ends with Usagi asking Mamoru about the time they first kissed, and it's all rather awkward (Mamoru's faulty memory notwithstanding).

If you're referring to episode 94 of the S season, then I really couldn't tell you. I re-watched it, and in the beginning of that episode Unazuki and Usagi are talking about first kisses, and when she asks Usagi if she's kissed yet, she doesn't really answer but gets flustered. It's hinted from her reaction that she might have done something more than kissing with Mamoru, but also in the first season she was 14, then 15, and now in the S season she might be 16. By the time Stars ends she's like what, 18?

In the manga, we clearly see that Usagi and Mamoru have sex, but we don't know that it's the first time, and it's at the very end. ANYWAY.

Back to that episode, Haruka and Michiru overhear and give their input and views on the subject, saying it's cute to be talking of first kisses. Michiru goes all history teacher on them by bringing up Adam and Eve.



YES, THAT IS A SREEN CAP OF USAGI AND MAMORU, BUT IT IS NOT ACTUALLY THEM.
Usagi fantasizes about being Eve, with Mamoru as Adam RIGHT AFTER MICHIRU TELLS THEM.

So, that scene can be disregarded.

I wasn't wedded to the idea that the silhouettes of Usagi and Mamoru served as concreted evidence that they were sexually active with one another. I am convinced however that the "kissing" theme in episode 94 was one giant double entendre.

Ha, ha! I remember that when I'd first started watching Sailor Moon, I'd heard that the Japanese version was so much more "adult." Seriously, there were people calling it "hentai" because there's nudity in it. And when people told me that the Sailor Moon anime was aimed at teens/adults, I believed them!

So when I watched that episode of S, I assumed that in the Japanese version they were talking about sex--especially when Elizabeth says, "Well, of course you haven't! You're only in junior high!" So I figured that Elizabeth was waiting for "her first" and that she had to do it with the right person! And that when Michelle was remembering her first kiss with Brad, she was actually remembering her first time having sex with Amara! And that when Elizabeth's heart crystal was taken, she was begging Lita to have sex with her...and finally, the conversation at the end...Serena asking Darien if she remembers the first time they had sex, and she gets pissed off that he doesn't remember! Hey, I'd be mad, too!

But then I looked it up and found out that yes, they were talking about kissing in the Japanese version, too.

Anyway! I don't think Mamoru is a cradle robber, either. I don't know why people are acting like it's so scandalous. I'm pretty sure they're not having sex, and I've definitely seen couples with their age difference.

And the age of consent in Japan is 13. I personally think that's too young, but it's certainly not a crime there.

Thereisnospoon303 wrote:

I wasn't wedded to the idea that the silhouettes of Usagi and Mamoru served as concreted evidence that they were sexually active with one another. I am convinced however that the "kissing" theme in episode 94 was one giant double entendre.

When you mentioned that, I just had to see for myself. For a moment I believed that they had had sex, but after watching that clip over it was made clear it was merely a day dream.

As for the two meanings, I think it was mostly supposed to depict how innocent Usagi was. Cause you know, in all of the re-makes [anime, live action, manga, musicals] Usagi is always depicted as the epitome of innocent, pure, and angelic.

Isn't there a scene in the manga where it is heavily implied that Usagi and Mamoru had sex?

I think there are several (but my memory is hazy), but I know there is one or two specific ones. Especially in the last act right before the marriage. Because after they get married Usagi is all "OH BTW I'M PREGGO" but she says it way more gracefully than that. XD

It hints at sexy time many times in the manga, but we don't know how far in the relationship or how serious they got in their past lives.

I always felt in their past lives it was pretty innocent, besides kissing. Since they both had such royal status, i don't know if they would have risked the sexy times.

I never got the impression that Prince Endymion and Princess Serenity were sneaking in some late night fun together. As Brit-chan said, their relationship was often presented as being closer to a secret courtship than a steamy, Harlequin novel love affair.

Touche, but in the modern times you never know. It's depicted a lot that most Japanese girls give it up with their first boyfriend.

I wouldn't be surprised if Mamoru and Usagi had sexual relations prior to marriage (the manga makes this explicitly the case), but Endymion and Serenity never appeared to enter that stage of their relationship before the Moon Kingdom was destroyed. A lot of their interactions fell under quick, secret meetings whenever they had the chance. I'm not certain if that would have even permitted for a meaningful sexual relationship.

Oh my gosh, I meant to post a topic about that cap! I was so shocked when I saw it and terribly confused. Why in the world did they show Usagi and Mamoru when Michiru was talking about Adam and Eve? O.o So odd. Normally I might think that this was implying what Usagi and Mamoru had done together but the way the scene was played out does not seem to line up. This cap is being played while Michiru is talking about Adam and Eve and then you see the girls' watching her. It is never implied to be Usagi's thoughts. I think the animators did that just to be romantic for the fans.

I actually have to disagree with Spoons and B-chan in terms of Serenity and Endymion -- I always felt that those were the two who definitely had sex and they were shown the most clearly. To begin with, the two seem more mature and there are a lot more intimate moments of them. As to the implications of them being more intimate, I always considered the scene on the right as proving so.


As for Usagi and Mamoru is the manga, that is a little more iffy. I always thought this scene in the manga was Naoko's insinuation that the two finally did have sex, because Usagi is blushing and her blouse (which was beneath her dress) is no longer there -- she now has Mamoru's shirt draped over her shoulders.


However, I was later proven wrong from this panel in the SuperS season. In another translation she says, "Just when I thought I was grown up enough for it." I think either way, it is clear what she is talking about.


I would not be surprised if they slept together past this point, but I always assumed that their first bedroom scene at the end of the manga was their first time.

In the anime, Usagi states in the beginning of the Stars season that she and Mamoru have not had sex (they are sitting on the park bench and she is all blushy and such). She is sixteen by that time, so even if they have sex afterwards, the odd age gap between her and Mamoru has pretty much ended.

Sailor Venus wrote:

If you're referring to episode 94 of the S season, then I really couldn't tell you. I re-watched it, and in the beginning of that episode Unazuki and Usagi are talking about first kisses, and when she asks Usagi if she's kissed yet, she doesn't really answer but gets flustered. It's hinted from her reaction that she might have done something more than kissing with Mamoru, but also in the first season she was 14, then 15, and now in the S season she might be 16. By the time Stars ends she's like what, 18?

In the manga, we clearly see that Usagi and Mamoru have sex, but we don't know that it's the first time, and it's at the very end. ANYWAY.

Back to that episode, Haruka and Michiru overhear and give their input and views on the subject, saying it's cute to be talking of first kisses. Michiru goes all history teacher on them by bringing up Adam and Eve.



YES, THAT IS A SREEN CAP OF USAGI AND MAMORU, BUT IT IS NOT ACTUALLY THEM.
Usagi fantasizes about being Eve, with Mamoru as Adam RIGHT AFTER MICHIRU TELLS THEM.

So, that scene can be disregarded.

^^^ Read my earlier post, Becca. <3 It was a dream sequence, meaning she WISHES she was Eve, and Mamoru as Adam. ^-^

Sailor Venus wrote:

^^^ Read my earlier post, Becca. <3 It was a dream sequence, meaning she WISHES she was Eve, and Mamoru as Adam. ^-^

Yah ... I didn't get that impression though because the camera never settled on Usagi before cutting to the Adam and Eve sequence. But if it does refer to Usagi's thoughts, I agree that it would be a wish of hers rather a reflection of what she and Mamoru had done.

Sailor Jupiter wrote:

Sailor Venus wrote:

^^^ Read my earlier post, Becca. <3 It was a dream sequence, meaning she WISHES she was Eve, and Mamoru as Adam. ^-^

Yah ... I didn't get that impression though because the camera never settled on Usagi before cutting to the Adam and Eve sequence. But if it does refer to Usagi's thoughts, I agree that it would be a wish of hers rather a reflection of what she and Mamoru had done.

I've only one more thing to say...

Nipple actionnnn.

XDDD I HAD TO, I'M SORRY. I REMEMBERED MY CONVO WITH CRYSTAL ABOUT THAT SCREEN CAP AND I LAUGHED. XDD

Oh, wow. I had never seen those panels from the manga before. I'll have to recant my previous position---one which was based on the scenes from the anime---and agree that Serenity and Endymion appear to be engaged in a sexual relationship. The more you know...

It would be nice if we just had a panel of Usagi comically dry humping Mamoru's leg. That would lay all the speculation to rest.

Thereisnospoon303 wrote:

Oh, wow. I had never seen those panels from the manga before. I'll have to recant my previous position---one which was based on the scenes from the anime---and agree that Serenity and Endymion appear to be engaged in a sexual relationship. The more you know...

It would be nice if we just had a panel of Usagi comically dry humping Mamoru's leg. That would lay all the speculation to rest.

^^^ I wish I could high five you right now. I snorted out loud and now my mom thinks I'm crazy. XD